🎧 Episode 9: Wireless Radiation & Fertility: Cell Phones, WiFi, EMF Exposure with Dr. Robert Brown
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In this episode of The WOVA Circle Fertility Podcast, I sit down with Dr. Rob Brown, a board-certified diagnostic radiologist with over 30 years of experience and Vice President of Scientific Research and Clinical Affairs at the Environmental Health Trust. We dive into why understanding wireless radiation exposure from cell phones and WiFi to laptops and wearables is essential for fertility, and how simple, practical changes can protect your reproductive health without giving up modern technology.
This eye-opening conversation explores Dr. Brown's groundbreaking 2025 ultrasound research published in Frontiers in Cardiovascular Medicine, showing what happens inside the body after just 5 minutes of cell phone exposure. We discuss why fertility rates have dropped 50% in 50 years, how wireless radiation affects sperm and egg health, why regulations are decades behind the science, and how EMF exposure disrupts the body's natural healing processes. Dr. Brown breaks down the science in accessible terms and provides actionable strategies to reduce exposure while living in the modern world.
📄 Read Dr. Brown's study: https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/cardiovascular-medicine/articles/10.3389/fcvm.2025.1499499/full
What You'll Learn in This Episode
The latest research on EMF exposure and what scientists are studying in relation to human health
How wireless radiation may impact fertility, sperm health, sleep, oxidative stress, and hormone balance
Why current safety regulations focus mainly on heating effects and where concerns remain
The connection between melatonin, circadian rhythm, and reproductive health
Gabie’s perspective after working for years inside the telecommunications industry
How technology, convenience, and public health intersect in today’s wireless world
Simple ways to reduce everyday EMF exposure without fear or overwhelm
Practical strategies for creating a lower-EMF sleep and home environment
Lifestyle and nutrition habits that may help support the body’s resilience and recovery from chronic stressors
⏱ Listen time: 55 minutes
🎧 Format: Video & Audio
📍 Best for: Individuals and couples considering or undergoing IVF, those wanting to better understand fertility treatment, and anyone looking for a more informed, balanced approach to reproductive health
👉 Explore Personalized Support with WOVA Health
👉 Learn More About Gabie’s Story
Podcast Transcript
Introduction
Gabie: Welcome to The WOVA Circle: real talk on fertility, wellness, and trying to conceive. I'm Gabie Peytchev, founder of WOVA Health and fertility educator. This podcast is your community space for navigating the path to parenthood with evidence-based insights, authentic conversations, and genuine support.
Welcome to the WOVA Podcast, where we explore the invisible factors affecting our health. I'm your host, and today I'm joined by Dr. Rob Brown. Dr. Robert Brown is the Vice President of Scientific Research and Clinical Affairs at the Environmental Health Trust. He brings over 30 years of experience as a board-certified diagnostic radiologist with a sub-specialization in musculoskeletal imaging, with an extensive clinical background spanning renowned institutions like the Cleveland Clinic and the New York University Hospital for Joint Diseases. Dr. Brown has interpreted imaging for more than 400,000 patients, giving him an experiential view into how diseases and injuries manifest and progress within the human body.
Before we dive in, I want to mention that today's conversation was inspired by Devra Davis and her book Disconnect. I completely loved it. It was a really eye-opening resource for me about what the telecommunications industry doesn't always share with the public. I spent five years in the telecommunications industry, so there were things I could confirm while reading the book — and we'll dive into that as well. Dr. Brown, thanks for being here.
Dr. Brown: Thank you very much. Happy to be here.
What EMF Actually Is — And Why Our Bodies Care
Gabie: Let's start with the big picture. Most people are surrounded by wireless signals all day — WiFi, cell phones, Bluetooth, smart devices at home — but most have no idea how much their exposure has increased. These technologies have never really been tested for long-term safety. From your research, what's the most important thing people are missing about EMF exposure? And let's clarify what EMF stands for.
Dr. Brown: EMF stands for electromagnetic fields, so we're talking about a form of energy called electromagnetic radiation. It's called that because it has two components: an electrical component and a magnetic component. This is the same type of energy we get from the sun. Light is a form of electromagnetic radiation, as are X-rays and the gamma rays we use in medical imaging, and the microwaves we use to cook food. The same frequencies we use for telecommunications — radio, TV broadcasting, and now WiFi and wireless communication — all fall under the umbrella of electromagnetic radiation, or EMFs.
Gabie: And our bodies also depend on electromagnetic fields, right?
Dr. Brown: Absolutely. We are electromagnetic beings — we're not just a bundle of chemicals. Every time an ion or even a water molecule moves through the body, it's creating a current and a field. We actually have biofields unique to us — our own energetic signature. This goes into realms that haven't been fully explored in the scientific literature, but it's true. We all have an energetic signature, and the environment affects it.
Gabie: These are normally low levels — there's a distinction between the low levels naturally in nature, which we depend on, versus the dramatic increase in exposure over the years that most people don't realize is happening.
Dr. Brown: Right. We evolved — as did all life on earth — in an environment where we're on a planet that's spinning. We face the sun for part of the day, then we have nighttime when we're away from it. We have a constant magnetic field from the earth, and our body functions depend on the time of day — the circadian rhythm. It's dependent on our exposure to daylight, to the natural electromagnetic fields from the sun. That's periodic — only during part of the day.
What we're doing with all this technology is creating a world where it's almost like we have a sun inside our bedroom. It's a source of energy, creating radiation, exposing us 24/7 — not just during the time we're supposed to be exposed to it.
Oxidative Stress: How EMF Damages Cells
Gabie: So there's no question electromagnetic fields affect us. If you increase that radiation multiple times, there must be a significant effect.
Dr. Brown: There's an effect — yes. What that effect is depends on the person. We know that this radiation causes something called oxidative stress. In simple terms, the cells being exposed go out of balance. They end up with too many reactive oxygen species — molecules looking for electrons — which makes the cell unstable. If those molecules don't get electrons from suitable sources, they can damage the cell and cause disease. So we're living with an increased number of diseases we probably wouldn't have if we were more cognizant of this type of energy causing them.
EMF and Fertility: A Growing Crisis
Gabie: Including infertility — it's been identified as a chronic disease as well. Infertility rates have been dropping globally by an average of 1 to 1.5% per year — so 50% over the last 50 years. That's a huge drop. Miscarriage rates are going up at a similar rate. Sperm counts are going down. Both female and male fertility are being affected. I think EMFs are making a huge negative impact on fertility.
I spent five years in the telecommunications industry. I worked at different large companies, and that experience completely changed how I see all of this. I was part of projects that built small cell antenna systems in San Francisco and other Bay Area cities — Berkeley, Oakland, the East Bay. In San Francisco specifically, most people don't even recognize small cell antenna systems. They're usually put on poles you see on street corners, sometimes on streetlights, often right in front of people's homes and bedrooms. They're topped with 4G and 5G antennas. What shocked me was how easy it is to get a permit from the city. The regulations can't keep up with how quickly the technology evolves and changes. I was shocked at the lack of regulation.
Why the Science Is Stuck: The Heating Myth
Dr. Brown: Right. The science currently accepted by regulators is that the only physiological effect of this type of radiation is heating — like a microwave oven. Physicists have divided radiation into two categories: ionizing and non-ionizing.
Ionizing radiation includes high-frequency energy waves with enough energy to knock an electron out of an atom's orbit — UVB, UVC, X-rays, and gamma rays. Everything else is considered safe unless it causes too much heating. So there are limits on how much radiation devices can produce, to avoid heating body tissues — but those limits have nothing to do with the non-thermal effects of radiation, which we are now well aware of. There are thousands of papers in the scientific literature documenting different effects. It's just an inconvenient situation that this trillion-dollar industry is based on a false premise that no harm is being done. We have a lot of work to do.
Gabie: Devra Davis mentioned this in her book — it's just like with the tobacco industry back in the day. They were creating doubt: "You're not sure. Is it safe, is it not safe?" The same is happening now with cell phones and smart technology.
Dr. Brown: Yes — exactly the same playbook.
Ionizing vs. Non-Ionizing Radiation
Gabie: Good distinction between ionizing and non-ionizing radiation. Many people don't understand this — even with X-rays and ionizing radiation, it took years for people to believe the science. I feel we're now in the same situation with non-ionizing radiation, even though there's a lot of research proving it's also harmful. Let's talk about non-ionizing radiation and why it's not just heat that's the problem.
Dr. Brown: Non-ionizing radiation includes light, infrared, radiofrequency radiation — which is what we use for wireless communication — and ELF, or extremely low frequencies, which come from power lines and electrical current.
This radiation gets absorbed into the body. Penetration depth depends on the intensity and frequency. Higher frequency means less penetration but greater energy. Increase the intensity and you can drive more radiation deeper. Even light, when intense enough, can penetrate the body — we use transillumination in the hospital to check for fluid buildup in the belly. The body is not impermeable to energy. The skin has chemicals that protect us from too-deep light penetration, but we have no physiological protection against microwave radiation — we didn't evolve with it in the environment.
Gabie: It would take thousands, if not millions, of years for people to adapt — and what's happening right now is in a matter of 50 years or less. It's too quick.
Dr. Brown: There's no way to evolve in this timeframe. I've read many of the papers showing different effects. You have to understand that some experiments are done on mice and small rodents. Penetration depth in a mouse versus a human isn't apples to apples. If a study shows the liver was affected in a mouse, that organ is only a few millimeters deep to the skin surface — in a human, it's centimeters deeper, and the radiation might not reach it. There are a lot of considerations with radiation that aren't the same as with a biochemical toxin, where you ingest something and it circulates through the blood systemically.
Gabie: That's also why it's harder to research — it doesn't have an immediate effect. Sometimes it takes years to manifest into cancer.
The Rouleaux Study: Proving Immediate Harm
Dr. Brown: That's true — but I did some research this past year that did show an immediate effect. It's caused quite a stir because it's one of the first experiments to show cause and effect in vivo.
We exposed someone to a cell phone for five minutes, then looked at the blood using ultrasound. The blood went from a normal state into something called rouleaux. Rouleaux formation is where red blood cells stick together like a stack of coins. When I came out of my residency back in 1995, you almost never saw rouleaux. If you did, you associated it with chronic disease states — multiple myeloma, hypergammaglobulinemia — and rouleaux indicated increased risk for strokes, heart attacks, ischemic limbs, and blood clots.
In our study, I did an ultrasound on the back of a volunteer's leg, exposed it for five minutes to a cell phone, then re-imaged. The blood went into rouleaux. That was published earlier this year in Frontiers in Cardiovascular Medicine. Since then I've looked at 40 additional subjects, and I'm finding that people are in rouleaux throughout the day. They're being exposed to radiation from their environment — cars, cell phones, routers, their friends' routers, wherever they go — and their blood is aggregating.
Gabie: This is huge. Only five minutes of exposure and you see that effect.
Dr. Brown: It may be less. We need to do experiments looking at one minute, two minutes. In the leg, the blood goes through the popliteal artery down into the calf, foot, and ankle. The blood that comes back through the popliteal vein has just been exposed in the artery and the capillaries. This is a deep vein — not the subcutaneous tissue or superficial veins. So the blood was exposed going down to the foot, and by the time it came back, it was clumping. That tells me it's probably an immediate reaction.
Gabie: And the phone was on but not actively in use.
Dr. Brown: Correct.
Gabie: So think about people talking on the phone for hours a day, right against their head.
Dr. Brown: I really don't recommend that. I really don't recommend putting a cell phone up to your head.
Cell Phones, Pockets, and Sperm Health
Gabie: Let's move to fertility. There's a lot of research on sperm health. The so-called testicular barrier — the delicate skin covering the scrotum — isn't really a barrier at all. The membrane covering the testes is about 100 times more sensitive to chemical exposures than any other skin surface.
Dr. Brown: Radiation doesn't respect cell barriers, doesn't respect the blood-brain barrier, doesn't respect any tissue barriers. That's a unique feature of radiation — it goes right through.
I just had a case at my regular job — a man who had a scrotal ultrasound, and the veins in his scrotum were showing rouleaux. I don't know if he had a cell phone in his pocket before the study, but I'd bet he did. Rouleaux is not limited to the leg. It can affect any region of the body, and that may be one reason sperm is being affected.
There have been studies showing decreased sperm motility, DNA damage to sperm (which can affect genetics), decreased sperm count, and reduced testosterone levels. Men can have lower testosterone just because they're being exposed to this radiation. A woman should never carry a cell phone in her bra or pants pocket. The same goes for men — never carry a cell phone in your front pocket, especially if it's turned on.
Gabie: What's your advice? Men carry cell phones in their front pockets all the time because it's convenient — they don't have a purse. Is the back pocket at least a little better for reproductive health?
Dr. Brown: For reproductive health, probably. But my advice is: turn it off. If you have to carry the phone from one place to another, get one of those cases with a strap. I carry mine on a strap so it dangles like a purse — and it's in airplane mode most of the time.
Gabie: That's a good idea.
Dr. Brown: We lived without this technology for many years, and suddenly people think they can't live without it. You don't have to have your cell phone with you all the time. And if you do, it certainly doesn't have to be on. It's a change in mindset.
Gabie: Think of the cell phone as a little microwave oven.
Dr. Brown: Pretty much. Some of them have up to seven antennas, emitting different frequencies at different intensities. It's extraordinary technology — I'm not saying I'm not impressed. But it needs to be used judiciously, with the understanding that it is a microwave producer. It's a source of energy.
Gabie: As much as we can't live without smart technology, we have to be smart about how we use it.
Outdated Safety Testing: The SAM Phantom
Gabie: At this moment we can't rely on the regulations. The testing has been done using a fake person they call SAM. It's modeled on the top 10% of the military — a tall, heavy man — nothing like the average person, let alone women, children, or fetuses still in prenatal life. The exposure is tested for six minutes on the phone at a distance from the ear. Even an inch of distance makes a huge difference. So distance, distance, distance is key. The regulations are about 30 years behind. We shouldn't be relying on telecommunications companies like T-Mobile or AT&T to tell us it's safe.
Dr. Brown: The test with SAM is to determine the Specific Absorption Rate, or SAR — how much heat is being produced in the tissues by the device. As we said, looking only at a heating effect is missing the point. Of course we don't want to be heated, but there are non-thermal effects these regulations aren't considering.
It's ludicrous that they're using this gigantic phantom — they fill the mannequin's head with a jelly that's supposed to simulate the electromagnetic properties of the body's interior, then do calculations to figure out the SAR. But radiation reflects off surfaces, can be refracted, and can accumulate in areas of the body depending on anatomy. The head is incredibly complex anatomically — it was the hardest part of my anatomy class. To think they're simplifying that by filling a head with goo is totally inaccurate.
But how else do you do it? You can't put probes in someone's brain. With a cadaver, the dielectric properties of the brain change because the water content changes. So in vivo testing is one of the major challenges. That's why my recommendation is just to limit your exposure as much as you can. Don't put devices on your lap. Keep distance between you and the emitter. If you double the distance, you decrease your exposure by three-quarters. Even a couple of inches matters. Increase distance, diminish overall use, and especially at night, sleep in an environment with minimal exposure — the body needs to be in a protected space at night to heal.
EMF-Blocking Products: What Works and What Doesn't
Gabie: Some countries are doing much better in terms of regulations than the United States or Canada — China, India, and Russia have maximum exposures 100 times lower for their citizens. If you're in the US, you really have to be your own advocate.
There are also a lot of companies coming out with radiation-blocking devices — phone cases, blankets, all kinds of things. What do you think about those? Because if radiation reflects back, and your phone is looking for signal harder in low-signal areas, isn't that double or triple the exposure?
Dr. Brown: Right. If you have a device that's truly blocking the radiation from your phone, you won't be able to make or receive calls. So most of those phone-case products probably aren't effective.
Some products are very good at blocking. I personally use a sleep canopy because I live in a city with a lot of RF — neighbors' WiFi, outdoor antennas. The sleep canopy does block RF. But you can't put a cell phone inside of it, because the radiation will bounce off the walls of the canopy and increase your exposure. So when you're blocking or trying to reflect radiation, you have to understand what you're doing.
If you wear a shirt or blanket with protective material, radiation can refract around it. If radiation is coming in at neck level and you're wearing a high-neck sweater, it can bend around the top and reach deeper into your upper chest. EMF behaves like light — it bounces off walls and objects. Light is a form of EMF, after all.
The Electromagnetic Spectrum and 5G
Gabie: Going back to ionizing — where are cell phones, tablets, and computers on that spectrum?
Dr. Brown: That's all microwave radiation, or radiofrequency radiation. It's non-ionizing, much lower energy than infrared, and higher energy than ELF from power lines. So somewhere in the middle. It's roughly from 200 megahertz up to about 8 gigahertz.
Now we have the high band of 5G, bringing us into millimeter waves — even higher frequency. Licenses go up to 99 gigahertz, though companies are mostly transmitting between 20 and 40 gigahertz. That allows for nearly instantaneous delivery of video. Information is encoded on a carrier wave. All radiation travels at the speed of light, so transmission is instantaneous — but as you increase the frequency, you can put more data on the wave. So a higher frequency lets you transmit more information per second. At 25 gigahertz — 25 billion cycles per second — you can transmit a whole video in the time it would take to send a fraction of it at a lower frequency. That's why they're going to higher frequencies.
Gabie: And when we build these new generations of networks — 4G, 5G — we don't remove the old ones. 2G and 3G stay active. You're layering new frequencies on top of the old ones. If a neighborhood needed 50 antennas for 4G, it now needs 2,000 to 4,000 for 5G because they have to be closer together.
Dr. Brown: Right. If you look at the frequency bands available in the 5G network compared to old AM radios — you're probably not old enough to remember, but in cars there used to be a dial. You could turn it four or five times to go through all the AM frequencies. With 5G, including low, middle, and high bands, you'd have to turn that knob something like 250 million times to get from one end of the 5G frequency band to the other. An extraordinary amount of spectrum is being doled out by government and the National Spectrum Management Association. It's big business.
These cell phones have many antennas operating at different frequencies. One antenna for tap-to-pay, another for Bluetooth, another for cellular data, another for 5G, another for GPS. If you don't turn them off, they're all running. I turn most of mine off unless I'm using them. If I need Bluetooth, I turn it on, then off when I'm done. I'm not getting that extra radiation for no reason.
Gabie: Sometimes it seems like extra work, but it's really about building healthy habits. It's not that big of a deal.
Hardwiring Your Computer and Reducing Daily Exposure
Gabie: Same thing with your computer. A lot of people work on a computer all day. You can just buy an ethernet cable — they're inexpensive, and they come in long versions so you can run one from room to room and attach it to the router. Then you don't get any radiation, and you turn off your WiFi on the computer. That's what I do at home — it kills the radiation right away.
Dr. Brown: That's right. Turn off AirDrop, Bluetooth, WiFi, and just hardwire the computer. No radiation.
Gabie: Another thing about 5G — telecom companies don't share their networks. So a single cell tower can have antennas from multiple telecom giants, each running their own equipment.
Dr. Brown: Right. And it's additive. As you increase the number of antennas, you're increasing the amount of radiation you're getting from them.
EMF, the Blood-Brain Barrier, and Reproductive Health
Gabie: What are you seeing in terms of health effects? In Devra Davis's book she discusses increased cancer risk, reproductive health (there's a lot of research on sperm, but also on women trying to conceive), brain health, oxidative stress, cellular damage. How are all of these connected? When we talk about fertility, we shouldn't focus only on reproductive organs — it's about the whole body. If you're increasing your brain cancer risk, you're affecting overall health.
In the book, she explains that radiation breaks down the blood-brain barrier. That was actually discovered through cancer treatment research — to get drugs into the brain, they had to break through the blood-brain barrier, and one way they did it was through radiation. So they proved radiation breaks through that barrier. And children don't fully have that barrier early on — they build it later. Their heads grow so fast in the first few years; in the first year, the brain triples in size. Everything is changing. The possibility of damage during development is much higher.
So when we talk about conception — even if you're able to conceive, the embryo is so early in development, every detail is critical. If radiation is breaking down the blood-brain barrier, everything circulating in the body — alcohol, drugs, environmental toxins — is now getting into the brain because it's lost that protection.
Dr. Brown: The areas being exposed are the areas being affected — it's not the entire brain, just a part. I'm not sure how long the effect lasts. Some of these things we don't know yet.
But I can tell you there's an increased incidence of neurological diseases — Alzheimer's, Lewy body dementia, Parkinson's. These have something in common: they're associated with abnormal protein aggregates in the brain. And abnormal protein aggregates are the result of oxidative stress. We know EMF causes oxidative stress. We know EMF can cross the blood-brain barrier when other toxins can't. So we're left asking — is EMF one of the reasons we're seeing this rising incidence of neurodegenerative disease? I think it is.
There's another disease, amyloidosis, which used to be extremely uncommon and is becoming much more common — also caused by abnormal protein aggregates. The idea of oxidative stress is really the precursor to many diseases, including cancer.
Antioxidants and the Body's Recovery System
Dr. Brown: It doesn't mean if your cells are going through oxidative stress that you'll get one of these diseases — but you're on the way. So I recommend people increase their intake of antioxidants — vitamin C, vitamin E, the full range. When you have oxidative stress, the cure is antioxidants.
The universal antioxidant the body uses is glutathione. Glutathione donates electrons to those reactive oxygen species. When it does, it binds to another glutathione molecule that's also given up its electrons. Antioxidants like vitamin C donate electrons back to glutathione, making it usable again. There are ways for the body to recover from oxidative stress — you just need to give it time. If you're constantly being exposed and never giving your body a chance to recover, you're going to get sick.
Gabie: Just a matter of time.
Dr. Brown: A matter of time. It's really important to make sure you have at least part of the day — preferably while sleeping — where your body can relax, heal, and know it's not being hit with anything it needs to defend against.
Gabie: Fertility researcher Rebecca Fett, famous for her book It Starts with the Egg, says 80% of male infertility is due to oxidative stress. There are definitely ways to address it — we just need to be aware and take action.
Melatonin, Sleep, and EMF at Night
Dr. Brown: The way you mentioned sleep is so important. The hormone your body produces when sleeping is melatonin, which is actually one of the most powerful antioxidants we have. If you're exposed to a flickering TV while trying to sleep, a WiFi router in your bedroom, or a cell phone turned on by your nightstand, you're not going to produce the melatonin you should. That's another reason people get sick — they're not producing melatonin, and they're not sleeping well. They may think they're sleeping fine because they're falling asleep, but the body isn't healing the way it's supposed to.
Gabie: Most people think the issue is the screen — the blue light versus red light, which is one factor. What about radiation itself affecting melatonin?
Dr. Brown: I'm not sure of the exact mechanism. With blue light, your eye has a pathway from the retina to the hypothalamus called the retinohypothalamic tract — separate from the visual system. It's not giving your brain spatial information or color, just signaling whether it's light or dark. When that pathway tells your brain it's dark, the brain starts producing and releasing melatonin.
Blue light at night confuses your brain into thinking it's the middle of the day, delaying melatonin production by hours. The natural light cycle goes red, then blue, then red again at sunset — that's what cues melatonin release. If you then turn on a blue light, you're creating chaos. There have also been studies showing EMF exposure from WiFi and cell phones affects melatonin production. Whether it's affecting the retina through the same pathway or causing a direct effect on the hypothalamus — I don't know. More research is needed.
There are so many research opportunities — it's exciting, but it's fraught with adversity.
Gabie: Hard to find sponsors.
Dr. Brown: People don't want to believe it, the industry doesn't want to support it, they don't want to know about it. But it's an exciting time to figure out more about how we function.
Gabie: It starts with the beginning of your day. If you have five minutes in the morning to get natural light before turning on your computer or phone, that's important — it sets your circadian rhythm for the day.
Dr. Brown: Right. That's all part of your circadian rhythm. Melatonin directs the circadian rhythm and ties you to the rotation of the earth. It actually ties us to each other — everyone living in the same area is experiencing the same sunrise, sunset, same degree of darkness. The animals are part of it too. It's like there's a community that exists just because of the circadian rhythm. It's magical. When you disrupt it, you take yourself out of that balance.
Real-World Use: Cars, Calls, and Daily Habits
Gabie: Let's talk about real-world use. When you're on a call moving in your car, your phone is constantly connecting to new cell towers. Every time it does that, it ramps up to maximum power so you don't lose signal — is that correct?
Dr. Brown: It depends on where you are, but yes, the strength of the signal is constantly changing.
Gabie: Would you advise people to avoid talking on the phone in cars? Cars are made of metal, so there's signal-blocking happening too.
Dr. Brown: Some of this has become part of the fabric of our society. It's hard to extricate yourself from all this exposure. I talk on my cell phone in my car through Bluetooth when I have to. Whatever you can do is helpful. The most important things to me are antioxidants and good sleep — so my body can heal.
Top Protection Tips
Gabie: What are your top tips for protection?
Dr. Brown: Never carry your cell phone in your pocket. And certainly a woman should never put a cell phone in her bra. I've seen that — it frightens me. I've seen breast cancers develop from it. There was a study with four subjects who carried their cell phones in their bras. They all had the same type of cancer in the same location — multiple cancers, all underneath where the cell phone had been. After reading that study, I thought: people need to understand. The breast is a very sensitive organ. Breast cancer incidence is always rising, and you do not want to increase your risk.
Gabie: Something that breaks my heart is when parents carry their kids in a carrier and hold their cell phone right next to the baby's head.
Dr. Brown: Terrible.
Gabie: Definitely don't do that. What about WiFi routers? I'd say know where it is in your home, don't sleep right next to it, and don't spend your whole day next to it.
Dr. Brown: I don't use a WiFi router at my house, but I know a lot of people are hesitant — or their spouse won't agree. A compromise is to put the router on an appliance timer so it turns off at night while everyone sleeps and turns back on in the morning. You're protecting your sleep but still have WiFi when you need it.
If you do use WiFi at home, you can actually make calls from your cell phone using WiFi calling. That decreases the exposure you get from cellular antennas.
Gabie: Okay — so turn off Bluetooth and cellular, just keep WiFi when you're home if you have a router.
Dr. Brown: Yes — and turn it off at night.
Baby Monitors and Protecting Children
Gabie: What do you think about baby monitors?
Dr. Brown: I used a baby monitor — but it was before they had Bluetooth. What I'd do now, if someone felt they needed one, is get a large shielding sheet or a piece of cardboard covered in aluminum foil and make a physical barrier between the baby and the monitor. Sound still comes over the barrier, but the radiation is reflected away from the baby. You get the benefit of monitoring without exposing the baby.
Gabie: And move it as far as possible to the other end of the room — maybe a corner.
Dr. Brown: If you have a shield, aluminum foil reflects all the radiation. I'd recommend anyone in this situation get a cheap RF meter — they're available on Amazon — so you have an idea of how much you're actually blocking. Protecting infants and small children from too much exposure is really important.
Special Considerations for Trying to Conceive and Pregnancy
Gabie: For people new to this, it can sound overwhelming. Let's share some top tips, especially for people trying to conceive. We've covered: men shouldn't carry cell phones in their front pockets, women shouldn't carry them in their bra. What else?
There were multiple studies showing that men who talk on the phone for more than two hours a day can affect their sperm — even though the phone isn't in the reproductive area. So maybe limit phone time. Some people have to be on the phone all the time for work — use speakerphone instead.
Dr. Brown: I always use speakerphone, yes.
Gabie: Or a wired headset, like I'm using right now. Any other top tips?
Dr. Brown: No to wearables. The smartwatch, the AirPods, the Fitbits — unless they're medically necessary. People always ask about hearing aids or other medical devices that emit RF. If it's medically necessary, you have to wear it. You can't say no to a pacemaker. But if it's not medically necessary, why expose yourself?
It's important to remember the rouleaux study. If you've got a cell phone in your pocket, the uterus may be remote from where the phone is, but if the phone is causing rouleaux formation and clumping your blood, it might be impacting oxygen delivery to the fetus through the placenta. We haven't shown that yet, but there are studies showing EMF is associated with low-birth-weight babies. The last I read, 36% of pregnancies now result in low birth weight — an alarming statistic.
The uterus is protected. There are several centimeters of thick muscle surrounding the developing embryo, plus the abdominal wall — many layers theoretically protecting the fetus from radiation. But the systemic blood effect might still be impacting oxygen delivery. Even though it may seem like your fetus is protected because it's so deep, I still wouldn't put a cell phone in my pocket or bra. Just keep it off your body.
Gabie: Pregnant women — keep it away from your abdomen, or if you're trying to get pregnant.
Dr. Brown: Don't put a laptop with WiFi on your belly while you're working. Don't put a tablet on your belly. You're asking for trouble.
Gabie: Sometimes we have a big belly — it's so easy to just hold your phone on top of it. But not a good idea.
Dr. Brown: Not a good idea.
Closing
Gabie: Thank you, Dr. Brown. Thank you so much for this conversation. I was so excited, and I learned so much.
Dr. Brown: Very happy to talk with you. This was great.
Gabie: We've covered a lot, and we have amazing tips for people who are trying to conceive. Reach out if you're looking for more insights and actionable steps for your specific journey. If this conversation resonated with you, that's exactly why we created WOVA — and why we have this podcast. Follow, subscribe, and share this with someone on their trying-to-conceive journey, someone who's pregnant, or anyone who might benefit from this conversation — which, in my opinion, is everyone.
Our mission is to help people — especially those struggling with infertility, parents, pregnant women, and children — understand the invisible environmental exposures around us and make informed choices.
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